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  "Frightening" or "Relaxing" sound quality?
What do I mean by that?
Not that I wish to start a new controversy --- knowing some of the usual contributors, it may not be entirely avoidable, so let’s see what gives.

Following some of the threads on the –ultimate- ‘phase-coherent’, 'time-coherent' or yet better, both, 1st order up to steep slopes, an so on, cross-over opinions, I have these notions. So let me explain.

One quite well known ‘maverick’ (done some picking on some other well known reviewer, posting it on his site...), somewhere he states: a good speaker must have the ability 'to frighten you' --- his words, and I can see/hear what he means, at least I think so.

Some other dealer in Wilson’s marvellous products (he's around my place), tells me he can only listen for about ½ hour than he is 'exhausted' --- i.e. too intense to do any longer listening…

Nobody is talking about ‘listening fatigue’ actually, it is more an emotional fatigue, as far as I get it.

Now me, I go to a life orchestra listening and emerge pretty well ‘up-lifted’, never had any fatigue (maybe my bottom, when it got a bit too lengthy) never mind emotional fatigue! Gimme Mahler, Stravinsky, Mussorgsky, heavy (classical) metal, whow --- upliftment. Never occur to me run away, get uneasy, GET FRIGHTENED!

I clearly get ‘emotional fatigue’ listening to some types of speakers!
What were they?
I think they had one thing in common: They all where, in some way, VERY realistic, but they also had something else in common, --- they did not, as it seems, stick too well to a reasonably flat amplitude response… ah ha.

What this design regimen seems to produce during listening to keep on making you jump? Apparently always something rather unexpected in happening! Now we do also know what makes us (as humans) ‘jump’: it is some unexpected ‘something’ coming ‘out of the bush’ a snapping branch, some sort of VERY REAL sound, that does not quite go along with the general set of the acoustic environment.

Now take some ‘benign, dumb’ kind of speaker, it has so little in REALISTIC sound to offer, it just can’t frighten you. You (your instinct, subconscious) just don’t ‘buy’ into it.
Now take a VERY realistic sound-producer (the ones that can make you jump) and mess with the amplitude response, what you are getting is this on the edge of your seat reaction. The VERY opposite of what a lot of music has as its intention. (Not like AV ‘Apocalypse now’ kind of chopper going to attack you from any old angle, top, behind, etc.)

Lastly, has this something to do with why lots of folks perhaps shy away from these sort of designs?
I have listened to my share and I shy away, because as REAL everything seems to be in the reproduction, it keeps me in a state of inner tension, apprehension --- even listening to some Mozart Chamber music, as there is ALWAYS something very REAL, but somehow unsettling going on.

It might just explain why some of these designs don’t ‘cut the mustard’ and not survive in the long run. Unless, and open to opinion, that we are (most of us anyway) so messed up and transistor-radio-sound-corrupted that we seem ‘unworthy of these ‘superior’ audio-designs.
I honestly don’t think so, but you may have it otherwise, as they say YMMV.

I thought it is of value to bring this up, since it does not ever seem to be part of any of the more ‘technical’ discussions ---- the human ‘fright/flight’ element in ignoring proper FLAT amplitude response in favour of minimal insertion losses, or proper impedance compensation, notch filtering, et al, just so to obtain this form of stressful realism.

It might be also something to do with age, a much younger listener (in my experience) likes to be stirred up, and emotionally knocked all over the place ---- listening to Baroque music like bungee jumping?!
Maybe.
It be interesting to hear if it is just my form of ‘over-sensitiveness’ that brings forth this subject.
Best,
Axel
Axelwahl  (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)

04-26-09
  Responses (101-150 of 152)
Click title to read one, or click date to read all below it.

05-07-09   Hey axelwahl ... a simply great post that started this threa ...   Timtim

05-07-09   Axel, i find it interesting, what your speaker designer has ...   Detlof

05-07-09   Oh boy. back to blaming the time alignment and phase alignm ...   Nilthepill

05-07-09   Hi atmasphere having learned a lesson from jeff roland? i t ...   Axelwahl

05-08-09   Hi detlof to answer your questions the man is listens to bot ...   Axelwahl

05-08-09   Axel, yes, your speaker-man's frontend isn't bad, as you say ...   Detlof

05-08-09   In my system, issues with massed strings were one of my last ...   Mapman

05-08-09   Axel, saying negative things about anyone on anything does ...   Nilthepill

05-08-09   Hi all, i see where we have gone off track. the phase/time a ...   Axelwahl

05-08-09   Axel, extremely well put! nothing is 100% perfect. i would ...   Nilthepill

05-08-09: Mapman
I think one key to good phase/time alignment is that drivers can overcome inertia and react fast to even very subtle signal changes.

The High Emotion line mentioned by Atmasphere appears to have a significant design focus on this.

Other champs in this area that I personally have direct experience with that are affordable are certain affordable models from Triangle.

OHM Walsh speakers are pretty good in this regard also IMHO.

I'm sure there are others from what I have heard in showrooms but I am less certain of the design focus with these. PSB in the more moderate cost range and mbl and Magico in the uper echelons are two others that come to mind.

Mapman  (Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)


05-08-09   Ok- let;s try a different tack. track 3 of the thin red line ...   Atmasphere

05-08-09   Yes! thanks once again atmasphere for keeping this conver ...   Mapman

05-08-09   Hi all, i'm pleased we've giving up fighting this 'issue' -- ...   Axelwahl

05-08-09   "i think the one other most important item, other than ...   Mapman

05-08-09   Bass pressures and wide dynamics can make you jump. but loud ...   Johnk

05-08-09   Why would one react the same way to something that is real, ...   Mrtennis

05-09-09   Hi johnk you say: proper systems will allow one to listen f ...   Axelwahl

05-09-09   Hi mrtennis you say: don't confuse the startle effect with ...   Axelwahl

05-09-09   "why would one react the same way to something that is ...   Detlof

05-09-09   I like the term " startle effect " ... this is a g ...   Timtim

05-09-09   Hi detlof: if you can be so taken with an illusion , more p ...   Mrtennis

05-09-09   "if you can be so taken with an illusion , more power t ...   Mapman

05-09-09   Hi mrtennis, seems you're still caught in decartes' illusion ...   Detlof

05-10-09   Mr tennis tends to asks many philosophical questions of dee ...   Shadorne

05-10-09   Hi detlof i think you are right there at it. in fact when i ...   Axelwahl

05-10-09   Hi shadorne: i don't think philosophy has anything to do wi ...   Mrtennis

05-10-09   Shadorn lol--- --- --- --- !!!!!! too good!!!   Samhar

05-10-09   Roflmao, thanks shadorne!!!!   Detlof

05-10-09   Hi mrtennis you say: philosophy has anything to do with the ...   Axelwahl

05-10-09   Sorry i should have put your whole front of sentence i.e. * ...   Axelwahl

05-10-09   you are right, i guess i meant semantics and not philosophy ...   Shadorne

05-10-09   My mentioning of decartes has nothing to do with philosophy ...   Detlof

05-10-09   Hi detlof you are the man, - go for the sexy and scary. i ...   Axelwahl

05-10-09   Semantics are important in science and engineering but alone ...   Mapman

05-10-09   A good stereo system puts you to sleep, while a bad one frig ...   Mrtennis

05-10-09   mrtennis, you have repeatedly stated in several threads that ...   Tvad

05-10-09   The thing about a full symphony is that it is emotionally an ...   Muralman1

05-10-09   It's just talk. a lot of things are said without any ddeep m ...   Mrtennis

05-10-09   better than a good try. a direct score! what is said is ...   Tvad

05-10-09   Here's what we know about mrtennis' world from past posts: ...   Tvad

05-10-09   Hi tvad: you have a bone to pick with me. however, i can't ...   Mrtennis

05-10-09   it reminds readers of the mrtennis paradigm, and is helpful ...   Tvad

05-10-09   I think habitual critics of other peoples systems they haven ...   Muralman1

05-10-09   i agree. it's unlikely you will find any criticism i have l ...   Tvad

05-11-09   Here is my stereo system: quad 57/magnepan 1.6 vtl deluxe ...   Mrtennis

05-11-09   i'll be sure to bookmark this one.   Tvad

05-11-09   Holy mo! you guys been busy kicking your cans about. well, ...   Axelwahl

05-11-09   "stating an opinion that is unimportant, like other opi ...   Detlof

05-11-09   Mr t.: somehow i was under the impression from your prior p ...   Mapman

05-11-09   Lol (((: shouldn't it be stereolized? but then no, we are al ...   Detlof

05-12-09   Hi, looks like break-time, pop-corn and drinks. to hell with ...   Axelwahl


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